Thank you what an absolute honour! I remember us talking about the library. I spoke with Michelle about it afterwards. Something like that would be the most wonderful thing indeed. I had a conversation with two friends about what I want to be buried with at the Stonehenge exhibition at the British Museum in London. Someone overheard us and joined in. Our Sacred Objects are not always seen as we see them by our family and loved ones. I have already albeit slowing begun my death cleaning. One of my neices is showing interest in all that I do and my hope is that as she gets older I can have a conversation with her about my bits and pieces although I don't want to burden her with feeling that she has to take care of them. It is a conundrum. I definitely have a vision of my death being a celebration. I have planned my funeral, then realised I need to die in the summer and have a sunny or at least dry day for my party. Maybe I also need to plan in the event of a winter death. Next weekend I am attending a conference on funerals and death rituals and a workshop on the Ritual of making and wrapping shrouds. I see a sacred stitching vision of women sat around in circle stitching shrouds. It's a vision I hold for myself. Myself and friends sat around stitching, creating my shroud stories shared, memories made, laughter. You know I share your thoughts on Western Society and Death
Reading this, I want a winter death and being buried in deep snow (not very practical, know).
I hope you will write a blog about the stitching vision and workshop on making shrouds! Sounds fascinating. I used to wrap all my shamanic practitioner students in a shroud during our death & dying module... (One sure-fire way of becoming a "popular" shamanic teacher, LOL!)
The idea of a library is wonderful, I have thought about where I would want my magical and sacred items to go after my death. The only thing I have come up with so far is for them to be returned to their original makers, but they're usually a similar age to me. And I have no children or close young relatives to pass them onto....although there are a couple of local groups/collections now I think of it - this conversation has just given me an idea, thank you!
I remember our meeting death day at the cemetery in the snow! I found a grave with almost my name on, hidden away in the saplings and ivy 😊 🪦
Nunhead Cemetery is quite a resource for my courses in London!
And yes, perhaps ideally local neighbourhood groups would have a "sacred objects tab" where items could reverently change hands (and ideally stay local and close to the spirits of the land). It's good to brainstorm with kindred spirits on this!
I don't want to be buried because I can't stand the thought of my bones being dug up and displaced later on. So probably cremation. I'd like one of my drums to go with me and my ashes to be scattered in a local place that I feel close to. I would wish for the ashes of my dog(s) to join mine there.
I always hope I will have time knowing beforehand that I will die. Then I would have dear people come visit and take some of my drawings or sacred objects home with them. If this can't be done I'm hoping a friend or relative will host a giveaway event for this after I die.
My father (77, still very healthy) has started "death cleaning", selling items he is not using anymore and that he knows my brother and I are not interested in. I am thankful he is doing that, after hearing stories of people needing two years to sort through their parent's stuff.
I hear you! I was strongly leaning towards cremation until I read some articles about what cremains actually do to the sites where they are scattered. I have more mulling to do. And a huge "well done" to your father!
Human cremains are extremely alkaline, which makes them harmful to plants and animals, also water and marine life. They can ruin fragile ecosystems (such as favourite beauty spots). In the article I read recently someone had spread cremains over the grave of a loved one. When the rains came it down they congealed into a messy cement-like coating, making the grave look like a total (rock solid) mess. They can also contaminate water. Animals might consume them, which might pose a health risk. Apparently the best way to do it is open sea, several kilometers away from any coast... Back to the drawing board in my final wishes!
There is the possibilityn of a nature cemetery. My wife who don’t want to be cremated , , has bought a place there and there your bones will not be removed after a certain time.
I also feel death has become horribly sanitized, medicalised and taboo. It's like something that only happens to ‘other’ unfortunates. One of the most illuminating things I heard on a documentary was from a hospice manager who said ‘there’s absolutely nothing medical about actually dying’. He’d had his own near death experience as a young man.
And I absolutely LOVE the idea of an archive. Beginner or young spirit workers could perhaps also volunteer to catalogue the collections as part of their training. Many archives are supported and stored via donations and volunteers only so why not for sacred objects.
I heard a palliative care nurse say recently: our bodies know how to die. That is beautiful and reassuring. Death is not a medical event, nor is birth (unless complications occur).
And I like the idea of volunteers cataloguing collections (but just reading it sounds overwhelming!)
This is such a gorgeous idea: "I have long had the vision of an archive or library of sacred objects (and maybe research and teaching notes) donated by spirit workers (or shamans, for those who prefer that word). The key concept here is that young (or beginning practitioners) are granted the opportunity to pick out a drum, cloak, piece of art, rattle or sistrum (and so forth) and become the sacred user and keeper of it until their own death. That would promote a sense of continuity and lineage that spirit workers in the Western world feel only rarely, (because we operate in a secular and fragmented world, a world that does not look after its spirit workers, especially in old age, when they cannot teach or host ceremonies any longer)."
I wonder if rather than having the objects all stored in one place (I would certainly not want to be responsible for tending the energy of that place!) there could be more of a connection service - a website perhaps that connects new practitioners to people who have things to donate.
Brilliant! I once again showed my age, didn't I? ;-)
Of course it needs to be a digital archive!! If the objects cannot be collected in person, the receiver will need to pay for package and posting (and maybe a small fee for the trouble taken by the family member or friend for storing, communicating and taking care of this matter).
I used to be active in a global group of teachers of shamanism. My youngest son was very active as a gifted "natural born shaman" at that time (and even wrote a little book at age 9, which some teachers still use with children and families). So anyway, then the emails started rolling in from elderly teachers. Would our son like to have their drum (rattles, teddy bear) etc. when they passed away? I soon had a vision of our son living in a museum, walled in by shamanic artefacts reaching the ceiling (by the time he left home) so I started politely saying no to those requests. (He is now 21).
But that planted the idea in my head, of facilitating some kind of archive for passing sacred objects on or down a spiritual lineage....
I could not help but think that writing the teacher's version of this complex situation would make a thought-provoking essay too. It is not all "love and light" on the teacher's side either! This profession is MUCH harder than it looks to outsiders. Just saying.... ; - )
Thanks for all of this! I think it would be wonderful for teachers to also share their experiences of complex moments around power and how they navigate them, challenges with students, etc. I realize that usually this sharing happens in peer support settings (the right use of power institute and association for spiritual integrity are the two main places I know of where teachers disclose these things - please share if you know of more!). The teachers who consistently abuse power don't usually share much, though I find it very interesting when they do.
Well, I wasn't planning to disclose or expose any specific intimate interactions with students and groups as that comes under the confidentiality that makes such groups possible (and much-needed safe space). I was thinking of (maybe but probably not) writing on the most general level about the issues (including power struggles) that certain students bring to classes, which affect both teacher and group immensely. Here I am referring to unhealed childhood issues, unresolved issues around authority figures, a complete lack of shadow work (and self-awareness). My point being that the power in teaching situations is not exclusively held by the teachers. Students lacking emotional security (or presenting with narcissism style issues) can affect teachers and the safety of the group very strongly. Which is why good teachers operate selection processes (which are not always fool-proof). In other words: the flip side of the coin, in terms of your explorations! Maybe I will write about this if ever I retire... : )
I would love to hear what you write about this. I agree it is very challenging as a teacher when this stuff comes forward - for me personally it is very difficult dance holding a group when one person in the group is wanting a lot more attention or wanting to process their triggers 1:1 with the teacher when the teacher needs to continue to teach and hold the group.
Thank you. I love the pictures in this one. My view of whether a human being is truly mature is this very thing- preparing for your own death, both in spirit and the necessary departure details. This relieves so much worry from the shoulders of those who have to deal with those details, who cannot guess what would please you, necessarily. But the personal preparation is also important. At the approach to death we may not be in a good state or indeed very able to do any pathfinding, so we need to do at least the run-way prep, and have some spiritual companions whom you can recognise long before you take-off. I can never understand why we have pre-birth classes for parents of coming babies, but we have nothing for the other end of our life which can only end in one way - the leaving of our bodies.
True about the classes! I do death-preparation work with clients and I teach Death & Dying to my practitioner students. There should be classes open to anyone who is interested, but in my experience such classes do not fill. There is a huge wall of denial and a fear of "tempting fate".
Indeed so! I have a number of friends whose spouses thought they would live forever and made no provision for their families - it beggars belief that someone you love could do this to their family!
I observe all the time that being in total denial is stronger than love, loyalty or friendship. To make the necessary provision they would need to face the reality head-on and talk about such matters to a solicitor, put such things in writing. I have also seen people walk away from close friendships, to avoid having to engage in doing any shadow work. Denial is a massive player in human reality. As is lack of accountability. Tragically!
Thank you what an absolute honour! I remember us talking about the library. I spoke with Michelle about it afterwards. Something like that would be the most wonderful thing indeed. I had a conversation with two friends about what I want to be buried with at the Stonehenge exhibition at the British Museum in London. Someone overheard us and joined in. Our Sacred Objects are not always seen as we see them by our family and loved ones. I have already albeit slowing begun my death cleaning. One of my neices is showing interest in all that I do and my hope is that as she gets older I can have a conversation with her about my bits and pieces although I don't want to burden her with feeling that she has to take care of them. It is a conundrum. I definitely have a vision of my death being a celebration. I have planned my funeral, then realised I need to die in the summer and have a sunny or at least dry day for my party. Maybe I also need to plan in the event of a winter death. Next weekend I am attending a conference on funerals and death rituals and a workshop on the Ritual of making and wrapping shrouds. I see a sacred stitching vision of women sat around in circle stitching shrouds. It's a vision I hold for myself. Myself and friends sat around stitching, creating my shroud stories shared, memories made, laughter. You know I share your thoughts on Western Society and Death
Reading this, I want a winter death and being buried in deep snow (not very practical, know).
I hope you will write a blog about the stitching vision and workshop on making shrouds! Sounds fascinating. I used to wrap all my shamanic practitioner students in a shroud during our death & dying module... (One sure-fire way of becoming a "popular" shamanic teacher, LOL!)
The idea of a library is wonderful, I have thought about where I would want my magical and sacred items to go after my death. The only thing I have come up with so far is for them to be returned to their original makers, but they're usually a similar age to me. And I have no children or close young relatives to pass them onto....although there are a couple of local groups/collections now I think of it - this conversation has just given me an idea, thank you!
I remember our meeting death day at the cemetery in the snow! I found a grave with almost my name on, hidden away in the saplings and ivy 😊 🪦
Nunhead Cemetery is quite a resource for my courses in London!
And yes, perhaps ideally local neighbourhood groups would have a "sacred objects tab" where items could reverently change hands (and ideally stay local and close to the spirits of the land). It's good to brainstorm with kindred spirits on this!
I don't want to be buried because I can't stand the thought of my bones being dug up and displaced later on. So probably cremation. I'd like one of my drums to go with me and my ashes to be scattered in a local place that I feel close to. I would wish for the ashes of my dog(s) to join mine there.
I always hope I will have time knowing beforehand that I will die. Then I would have dear people come visit and take some of my drawings or sacred objects home with them. If this can't be done I'm hoping a friend or relative will host a giveaway event for this after I die.
My father (77, still very healthy) has started "death cleaning", selling items he is not using anymore and that he knows my brother and I are not interested in. I am thankful he is doing that, after hearing stories of people needing two years to sort through their parent's stuff.
I hear you! I was strongly leaning towards cremation until I read some articles about what cremains actually do to the sites where they are scattered. I have more mulling to do. And a huge "well done" to your father!
Are they bad..? Might need to start mulling too, then.. I would not want that.
Human cremains are extremely alkaline, which makes them harmful to plants and animals, also water and marine life. They can ruin fragile ecosystems (such as favourite beauty spots). In the article I read recently someone had spread cremains over the grave of a loved one. When the rains came it down they congealed into a messy cement-like coating, making the grave look like a total (rock solid) mess. They can also contaminate water. Animals might consume them, which might pose a health risk. Apparently the best way to do it is open sea, several kilometers away from any coast... Back to the drawing board in my final wishes!
I never knew! Thanks for sharing!
There is the possibilityn of a nature cemetery. My wife who don’t want to be cremated , , has bought a place there and there your bones will not be removed after a certain time.
I, myself prefere a cremation .
I also feel death has become horribly sanitized, medicalised and taboo. It's like something that only happens to ‘other’ unfortunates. One of the most illuminating things I heard on a documentary was from a hospice manager who said ‘there’s absolutely nothing medical about actually dying’. He’d had his own near death experience as a young man.
And I absolutely LOVE the idea of an archive. Beginner or young spirit workers could perhaps also volunteer to catalogue the collections as part of their training. Many archives are supported and stored via donations and volunteers only so why not for sacred objects.
I heard a palliative care nurse say recently: our bodies know how to die. That is beautiful and reassuring. Death is not a medical event, nor is birth (unless complications occur).
And I like the idea of volunteers cataloguing collections (but just reading it sounds overwhelming!)
This is such a gorgeous idea: "I have long had the vision of an archive or library of sacred objects (and maybe research and teaching notes) donated by spirit workers (or shamans, for those who prefer that word). The key concept here is that young (or beginning practitioners) are granted the opportunity to pick out a drum, cloak, piece of art, rattle or sistrum (and so forth) and become the sacred user and keeper of it until their own death. That would promote a sense of continuity and lineage that spirit workers in the Western world feel only rarely, (because we operate in a secular and fragmented world, a world that does not look after its spirit workers, especially in old age, when they cannot teach or host ceremonies any longer)."
I wonder if rather than having the objects all stored in one place (I would certainly not want to be responsible for tending the energy of that place!) there could be more of a connection service - a website perhaps that connects new practitioners to people who have things to donate.
Brilliant! I once again showed my age, didn't I? ;-)
Of course it needs to be a digital archive!! If the objects cannot be collected in person, the receiver will need to pay for package and posting (and maybe a small fee for the trouble taken by the family member or friend for storing, communicating and taking care of this matter).
I used to be active in a global group of teachers of shamanism. My youngest son was very active as a gifted "natural born shaman" at that time (and even wrote a little book at age 9, which some teachers still use with children and families). So anyway, then the emails started rolling in from elderly teachers. Would our son like to have their drum (rattles, teddy bear) etc. when they passed away? I soon had a vision of our son living in a museum, walled in by shamanic artefacts reaching the ceiling (by the time he left home) so I started politely saying no to those requests. (He is now 21).
But that planted the idea in my head, of facilitating some kind of archive for passing sacred objects on or down a spiritual lineage....
Oh and on a different topic: I read your essays about shadow manifestations of working with spiritual teachers (for my audience, here is the link to the most recent piece: https://open.substack.com/pub/rayanngordon/p/when-bliss-comes-with-a-cost?r=2olbkh&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web&showWelcomeOnShare=false)
I could not help but think that writing the teacher's version of this complex situation would make a thought-provoking essay too. It is not all "love and light" on the teacher's side either! This profession is MUCH harder than it looks to outsiders. Just saying.... ; - )
Thanks for all of this! I think it would be wonderful for teachers to also share their experiences of complex moments around power and how they navigate them, challenges with students, etc. I realize that usually this sharing happens in peer support settings (the right use of power institute and association for spiritual integrity are the two main places I know of where teachers disclose these things - please share if you know of more!). The teachers who consistently abuse power don't usually share much, though I find it very interesting when they do.
Well, I wasn't planning to disclose or expose any specific intimate interactions with students and groups as that comes under the confidentiality that makes such groups possible (and much-needed safe space). I was thinking of (maybe but probably not) writing on the most general level about the issues (including power struggles) that certain students bring to classes, which affect both teacher and group immensely. Here I am referring to unhealed childhood issues, unresolved issues around authority figures, a complete lack of shadow work (and self-awareness). My point being that the power in teaching situations is not exclusively held by the teachers. Students lacking emotional security (or presenting with narcissism style issues) can affect teachers and the safety of the group very strongly. Which is why good teachers operate selection processes (which are not always fool-proof). In other words: the flip side of the coin, in terms of your explorations! Maybe I will write about this if ever I retire... : )
I would love to hear what you write about this. I agree it is very challenging as a teacher when this stuff comes forward - for me personally it is very difficult dance holding a group when one person in the group is wanting a lot more attention or wanting to process their triggers 1:1 with the teacher when the teacher needs to continue to teach and hold the group.
Thank you. I love the pictures in this one. My view of whether a human being is truly mature is this very thing- preparing for your own death, both in spirit and the necessary departure details. This relieves so much worry from the shoulders of those who have to deal with those details, who cannot guess what would please you, necessarily. But the personal preparation is also important. At the approach to death we may not be in a good state or indeed very able to do any pathfinding, so we need to do at least the run-way prep, and have some spiritual companions whom you can recognise long before you take-off. I can never understand why we have pre-birth classes for parents of coming babies, but we have nothing for the other end of our life which can only end in one way - the leaving of our bodies.
True about the classes! I do death-preparation work with clients and I teach Death & Dying to my practitioner students. There should be classes open to anyone who is interested, but in my experience such classes do not fill. There is a huge wall of denial and a fear of "tempting fate".
Indeed so! I have a number of friends whose spouses thought they would live forever and made no provision for their families - it beggars belief that someone you love could do this to their family!
I observe all the time that being in total denial is stronger than love, loyalty or friendship. To make the necessary provision they would need to face the reality head-on and talk about such matters to a solicitor, put such things in writing. I have also seen people walk away from close friendships, to avoid having to engage in doing any shadow work. Denial is a massive player in human reality. As is lack of accountability. Tragically!